(a) I seem to recall that a few years back, someplace in North America actually passed this, or something like it, as explicit legislation. It's not too far-fetched that a court could think the same way. [Note also that we're veering back and forth here across the line between criminal culpability and civil liability -- two different sets of rules that don't always align perfectly.] (b) There was a recent (~6 months) decision in Georgia, specifically about port-scanning/network probing, which could be interpreted (reversing the analogy) as saying that if someone "borrows" your car, and puts it back before you want to use it, then *they* have committed no crime.... David Gillett On 11 Jun 2001, at 13:01, Webmaster wrote: > Ken, > To clarify, you say that if I leave my keys in the car and the > door unlocked and someone steals the car and kills someone with it, > I'm partially liable? That's stretching it a bit...I think the > burden should fall squarely on the shoulders of the person that > stole the car. Please don't think that this means that *every* > situation like this is the same. But I don't think we need to > start putting the folks that can't remember to tie their shoes in > jail... > Michael Sorbera > Webmaster > Randolph-Brooks Federal Credit Union > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claussen, Ken" <kclausse@columbus.rr.com> > To: "'Zachary Uram'" <zu22@andrew.cmu.edu>; "'Young, Beth A.'" > <youngba@more.net> > Cc: <firewalls@Lists.GNAC.NET> > Sent: Monday, June 11, 2001 11:30 AM > Subject: RE: 3rd party liability Was RE: This is a must read document > > > > ***Disclaimer I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV**** > > First I agree with the author's perspective, people should be held > > accountable for their actions, or inaction. My understanding of the > article > > was if you had the club on the car then you upheld the "reasonable > > expectation" of personal protection and therefore would not be "Held > > liable"(read negligent) in this case should a crime be committed. A better > > analogy would be to say if you left the keys in the ignition and the door > > unlocked and someone then used your vehicle to commit a "Hit and Run" that > > there is a far greater likelihood your actions would be found negligent > and > > you could be held accountable. In other words if you provided easy access > > to the "Weapon" for a third party, then you are as much as fault as the > > person who committed the crime. Hence the potential to be charged as an > > "accomplice" to a murder. Same applies to computers, if you enable "File > and > > Print sharing" and do not take measures to protect yourself, IE a Virus > > scanner and/or (IMO both should be required) personal firewall then > > essentially you have left the keys in the ignition and the doors unlocked. > > Anyone for a joyride? > > > > Ken Claussen MCSE CCNA CCA > > Ken@kccweb.com > > "The Mind is a Terrible thing to Waste!" > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: firewalls-owner@Lists.GNAC.NET > > [mailto:firewalls-owner@Lists.GNAC.NET]On Behalf Of Zachary Uram > > Sent: Monday, June 11, 2001 10:59 AM > > To: Young, Beth A. > > Cc: firewalls@Lists.GNAC.NET > > Subject: Re: 3rd party liability Was RE: This is a must read document > > > > > > this is silly position but understandable considering we live in > > most litigitous country in the world. > > this is analogous to saying if you don't have "The Club" on your > > car you are liable if someone steals it and commits a crime. > > > > > > > > uram@cmu.edu > > "Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have faith." - John 20:29 > > > > - > > [To unsubscribe, send mail to majordomo@lists.gnac.net with > > "unsubscribe firewalls" in the body of the message.] > > - > > [To unsubscribe, send mail to majordomo@lists.gnac.net with > > "unsubscribe firewalls" in the body of the message.] > > - > [To unsubscribe, send mail to majordomo@lists.gnac.net with > "unsubscribe firewalls" in the body of the message.] > - [To unsubscribe, send mail to majordomo@lists.gnac.net with "unsubscribe firewalls" in the body of the message.]